Your Safe
 

I just moved a 1040 pound safe in a pickup truck. I loaded it with help of 2 guys sliding it for 20 feet on two by fours. It took us about 9 minutes working slowly.

So the point of this story

Bolt your safe down

P.S. that safe cost me 280 bucks when new they are 1500 for that model
It is 45 x 24 x 20 on the inside. Fire rated for one hour and is UL RSC spec. Residential Security Container.

Me happy

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worthless.. no place to put rifles..
:bear_w00t:

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I'm envious. What a great deal on the price. Looks sturdy too.
Take care,
Mod1

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That safe will weigh over 5000 pounds when full.

I'm not too worried about some guys with 2x4s loading one in the back of a truck.:rolleyes_m:

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Those are shelves

and a Alpha Kappa fit perfectly well inside. 45 inches tall

I found it on http://crazedlist.org

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Sliding it into it's own cubby hole prior to bolting it down is a good idea as well. A RSC can be opened with common tools in a matter of mintues from the back, sides, or top. Most RSC's are thin wall sheet (.120 thick or less) in these areas. Might want to lock up your tools if you have any too. Getting your safe pealed with your own drill and sawzall might feel twice as bad.

Re: Your Safe
 

I was just looking at a something that would "better" this item in exactly this fashion as I do not really have a "cubby hole for that.

Mostly though it is for liability purposes anyways. I am in Cali after all. I do not want someone to take off with my 12 gauge and then have that hang over me.

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Put some lead shot or bricks of nickels or of the "golden" $1 coins in the bottom for weight. I need to get a safe myself, but I live in an upstairs apartment at the moment (with plans to be moving around a bit in the near future). Not too sure what route I'll take.

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I wouldn't mind getting a safe, but how the heck do I get it in the house without the neighbors seeing it? Some of my neighboors, I would not put it past them to break in.

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If you have a garage and if you can park in that garage :) then you can drive the safe in a pickup right in and unload from a pickup

I drove mine on a nissan frontier.

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I would not be caught dead in an American vehicle

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Ah, but what if someone cuts a hole in the top with a thermal lance, fills the safe full of water, lowers a waterproof explosive charge in, then sets it off. Would pop it right open. :)

(Saw it in a movie once).

Probably beyond the skills or thinking of the average numbskull though...

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thanks for the link, I never knew that existed

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A gun safe? Filled with water? Then detonated from INSIDE?

If they go through all the trouble they can have the bent metal. I'll just call my insurance.

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BTW--when i bought my primary residence it came with a floor safe that the dial did not turn and broker told me previous owner had not opened.

anyway, i received the combo from the manufacturer who bought the old manufacturer of the safe.

no dice. tried all sorts of combos. nada.

couple of weeks ago, started drilling.

let me say that again: couple of weeks ago, started drilling. 5+ hours has me about 3 centimeters through the hardened steel.

moral of the story: movies are bullshit.

Re: Your Safe
 

Not true!

The government has transponders in 20% of silver and gold American Eagles, as well as all 90% coinage and Engelhard and JM ingots. Certain factions within the NSA and black-budget organizations are having a turf war, and need citizens' PM holdings to fund secret ops against one another, by buying illegal narcotics in South America and funneling them through the middle east, where they are traded for oil that is then sold to wealthy black-market weapons dealers.

One older, recently-divorced CIA vet (former special forces), called Jack Clayton, or maybe Mike Ryan, struggling with both his disillusionment with the CIA and his feelings for his ex-wife, as well as trying to be a good dad to his outwardly tough but inwardly vulnerable latch-key son, takes charge of a crew of young, photogenic, and crew-cut junior CIA ops determined to get to the bottom of things. These kids have tough, checkered backgrounds themselves but are a cut above morally, especially when contrasted with Jack Clayton's boss in the CIA, who is older, has lost his way, and will stop at nothing to keep Project Blackstone funded and continuously spying on American citizens.

Jack and his boys lace your neighbor's homes with thermate and flood it, creating canals where once there were streets. At a predetermined moment during the visit of the front-running presidential candidate, a nuclear device goes off, killing the candidate, who is actually a double, and activating sleeper agents who have been hypnotized to carry out the demolition of houses in your area. Boom, boom: down they go, dropping faster than freefall, and some of the NSA ops capitalize on this to move in on speedboats, pulling your safe out from under 15 feet of water and racing through the canals of your city. Some of Jack's men pursue them, but only to give the impression that they actually have the goods, while they await a signal from Jack and the nerdy electronics genius of the bunch, who have lifted your real safe using a remote-controlled underwater helicopter and a tunneling machine, replacing it with a decoy safe, and pulling it out of the tunnel at an undisclosed location several miles away.

At this point we learn that Jack's wife has been kidnapped by another faction within the government, working in tandem with Jack's compromised boss. Jack puts his life on the line to save his wife and child, thereby repairing his marriage. In the course of the action, the most admired young man in Jack's crew is killed by the Eurotrash ringleader of the NSA faction.

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Couldn't ya just get a full size pickup and snake some serious high tension cable through a ground floor door or window?

Your Safe
 

Dand F what a script, you need a good marketing agent.

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There has been a lot of talk about how to and how not to store your physical precious metals and jewelry.

A single safe is a terrible way to store your valuables, it can be cracked, drilled, AND EVEN WORSE: it can get a gun pointed at your head or your family members if found while you're there.

So here I'll outline what I see as the best approach, which is a layered one, and will not only save you from catastrophic theft when you are not around but should also provide the best protection for any possible "gun to the head" situation.

There are 4 categories and they all should be used.


1. Let's start with the SDB.
You should have 2 of these (min. 2 spots) and they should be at different banking institutions and some distance from each other (farther away usually the better). They should be local S&Ls or Credit Unions with managers who demostrate a disdain for the dept of homelandtheftandslavery, if at all possible.
You should keep a list on you and at home which lists most of your valuables as being in there, whether they actually are or not, which of course is a different matter and entirely up to you.
(Min. 2 spots to contain valuables in this example scenario)


2. Now let's move on the home safes.
You should have a min. of 3 of these (min. 3 spots), of which only 1 is behind a locked closet and all the others well hidden (floor safes under hidden floorboards and behind the wall safes are 2 of the most obvious ways, but try to be more creative if you can).

The safe which is easily found and one of the others should contain a mixture of both real BUT MOSTLY fake valuables.
A few real silver and gold coins and jewelry and some very high quality fake jewelry (like semi precious gemstone rings and so forth are good examples). Do not go overboard with the fakes and do not use plastic or easily recognizable fakes.

Beyond those 2 safes, the other(s) should contain your precious metals and jewelry stash.

(Min. 1 spot to contain valuables in this example scenario)


3. Next, the home hiding places.
You should have at least 3 different home hiding places (min. 3 spots) for some of your valuables.
I'm not going to go into details here, you need to be creative.
One example I will provide is the hollowed out 2x4 filled with some coins and nailed back into place, behind the dry wall or in the roof rafters.
(Min. 3 spot to contain valuables in this example scenario)


4. Finally, let's move on to the buried treasure.
2 distinct property locations is best but not essential.
On each property you should have dug at least 5 holes each (min. 5 spots each location = 10 spots total min.) to a depth of at least 3.5 feet and place plastic containers in them.
Most of these containers should have metal tools, nuts and bolts and misc items.
At most, only 2 out of 5 holes dug should contain actual valuables inside the plastic containers.
(Min. 2 spots to contain valuables in this example scenario)



If you think this all sounds too hard, believe me, it was not, especially compared to the time and effort spent on food and other material preps and a getaway ranch for when TSHTF, which if I remember took at least 15 times as long to accomplish.
If TS does not HTF then that will be nearly a year's work wasted, but hey, I can pass the preps and knowledge to my heirs and I've already started eating into the food (as per the rotation thing), so at least have now started saving some money there via the inflation lag effect.


Let's now address individual situation...
If you are just starting out and don't have much in the way of valuables, say less than 7,000 USD worth, then you can cut down the above suggestions to only 1 spot in each category. For 3,000 USD worth or less, I would skip the SDB category also.

I suggest between 1 and 2 thousand dollars worth of valuables in each spot, except for the best hidden home safe which could contain double more, and also the SDBs if you feel comfortable with your bank.
The reason behind picking about 1500 USD in each spot is that in the above example there are 8 spots which with the 3 double-up spots brings valuables to about 17,000 USD which is probably what most of us GIMers have in their physical portfolio.
Also, I expect everyone here, including myself is waiting for $1500 to increase in value to about $10,000 for the PMs before selling anything, and so basically you could take 1 spot out at a time when it comes time to sell and still not need to hassle with the 10k paperwork threshold.

For high net worth individuals, say between 17 and 40 thousand worth of physical valuables, I would increase the number of spots respectively. Beyond 40k, you should drastically increase the protection layers, but I don't know much about this as I and most people in middle america don't fall into this situation.
Another suggestion for those in this over 17 group would be to use a safe which triggers a silent alarm. Basically you have 2 combinations, both open the safe, but one of the combos also triggers a silent alarm.

For who to tell about the whole structure and buried locations and so on, is something you will need to work out as per the trustworthyness of family and their locations around the country. Sealed, only to be opened upon death, documentation can be stored in a trust, and there are even offshore services that are outside the jurisdiction of our feds if you want to go to that level.

Re: Your Safe
 

Nice write up funny money. I will have to save that one for later use...

Re: Your Safe
 

It could happen.

E-A

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I would use a safe to store something like toilet paper maybe, and hide my valuables someplace secret.

Then when burglars come they will easily find the giant safe and immediately think it must hold something really valuable. They will spend all their time trying to open it or to haul to whole thing away, while probably spending little to no time searching the rest of the house.

Then if they dont get caught while trying to open it or haul it away they will be be demoralized to learn they spent all that effort to steal... toilet paper.

Re: Your Safe
 

When does this go into production? :D

Re: Your Safe
 

I swear he is Mo Rocca -- that guy doesn't seem to have a job anyway (other than "Wait! Wait! Don't Tell Me!" on NPR). As I read his posts I hear that pinched nasal voice...

Re: Your Safe
 

I'm hoping to move soon so I have some questions:

How did you get it in the pickup truck?

Most houses have atleast one step going into it, how'd you handle that?

BTW, Nice buy for $280!

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I did that with one of my smaller safes. It is a 250lb sentry safe. I put it inside a closet, and framed around it, so it couldn't just be dragged out easily. That, plus it having hundreds of pounds of you know what in it, made it pretty hard to get out. My gun safe is 800 lbs empty. I still need to bolt it down, and frame around it as well. Having a drywalled frame around the safe gives it that extra bit of fire protection. A real good place to hide a safe is under a stairwell, behind a false wall. You can make it look like there is a support wall there for the stairs, but have the safe behind it. Stack a bunch of normal "in the closet" type stuff in front of the wall.

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Watch on garbage night for an old fridge. Grab it and strip the outer shell. Slap that over the top of the safe and noone's the wiser. In fact, to keep your safe safe, keep the fridge shell on it in the house. Noone's gonna look twice at an old fridge in the basement. Particularly if you tape a power wire across the front to show that it's unplugged.

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Or just a refrigerator box might be good enough cover just for loading it into the house? Probably grab one from Sears or Home Depot for free.

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Started to really look at safes. Seems like the major names are selling crap. I just called about a Graffunder E6026 (Weighs 2700lbs when competitors weigh 800-1000). Asking price $10,199. Ouch!

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I think these are the best value: www.sportsmansteelsafes.com

The place I got my safe from (online company) closed shop, otherwise I'd point you there. My safe is only about 350 pounds, but it comes with the hardware to bolt it to the floor. If you can bolt it to a concrete floor it is as good as 2,000 pounds +.

Be sure to get a safe with twice as much space as you think you will use. I'm glad I did. Some other things to look for:

1. Two hour fire rating (ceramic fire protection is best)
2. Heat expanding air-tight door seal (integrated into the door)
3. Dead bolts on BOTH sides (latch and hinge sides)
4. Extra-heavy "burglary" hinges
5. Key activated combination lock (tumbler disengaged until key is inserted and turned).

I would avoid any electronic safe. Just stick with a good mechanical tumbler. 4-digits is better than 3.

I paid about $650 delivered (company offered free delivery).

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I have Cannon and Liberty safes. They are nice but if someone is really determined they can get at it. On A&E or similar show, there was a locksmith who was taken to a bank and presented a bank vault to open sight unseen. They timed him and he had it open in 8 minutes using no tools whatsoever, just the feel in his fingers.

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I have alot of safes-the best ones made of glass! The best part is only 2 people on earth know where they are, they are cheap, they are portable, and the "key" is a common shovel.

Re: Your Safe
 

I've never seen a home safe with key activated combination lock. That's cool!
Now what did I do with that damn key? :shocked_ma:

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Mine is. I have two keys in specific locations. :wink: Also, I have given a sealed envelope to my parents and my brother with the key location and combination. Inside the safe there is an envelope detailing the contents and explaining what needs to be done if I'm not around anymore.

Re: Your Safe
 

The Eagles transponder chip theory.Bunk.On x-ray machines, gold and silver show up as black unpenetrable objects(confirmed by TSA).
LEAD the same.There is nothing YET, no known frequency able to pierce lead, gold, silver(dense metal) that can be packaged and powered in a chip.With that said, perhaps those stickers on the plastic monster boxes have a chip (I am certain they do) or maybe the plastic Mint containers may contain the chip. Ditch the mint plastic and store the PMs naked. Fill the empties with ordinary coinage and put in your decoy safe.Then-ditch all your high dollar safes as they are worthless when the govt authorites want in.
Should decide not to ditch your safe-
I learned from experience, ANY safe out there the govt agencies have the combos, keys, etc. Do you trust our keystone cops not to let them out? Remove all identifying marks from your safe,serial numbers, brand names, etc... as the first step for them is contacting the manufacture and they will turn over all combos etc. ALTER the appearance of the safe, do anything so the MAKE and MODEL can not be identified.Then go out and spend $15.00 on a case of mason jars. Don't forget the shovel.

With more time I can give more ideas-like burying LIVE electrical lines dead ended, hooked up to at least a 20 amp circuit. The higher the better-match your wire gauge to the circuit.No current draw sitting quietly ,unmolested ,underground, minding its own business . Any diggers on your property will get discouraged when short circuiting the wire with their shovel blade. Use your imagination-that 220 line buried to your house meter? Ever see 220 blow off when shorted???????? Be sure to post no trespassing signs, states will not press charges when they find a few expired crispy critter carcasses.

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I've yet to see a mason jar large enough to hold a 12 gauge.

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There was one step. All I did was slide the safe on four 2x4s moving the wood as needed. to get onto the truck i removed the back door completely and put two 2x4s diagonally. then i with help of 3 guys tilted the safe so it rested on these 2x4s. then i used ratcheting tie down rated for 800 pounds to pull it onto the truck. once more than half of it was over the edge of the bed it tilted and we just pushed it onto the bed. I had the gardener help with lowering it from the truck. I think it is possible to do the movements by oneself with the ratchet tie downs.

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Moving these large boxes is not that difficult it just takes a little knowledge.

Once I went to Georgia and bought a lot of carpet and hauled it home in my pickup. I found an older guy to lay it but figured he would have to cut it in the yard as I didn't know how we would get the one large roll out of the garage and into the house.

The old guy by himself moved a roll of carpet 12 feet long and 2 feet in diameter into the house in 5 minutes and never even broke a sweat.

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Just FYI, the average safe dial lock is garbage and shouldn't be relied on as part of a security plan other than maybe keeping your kids out. Anyone who can manipulate a safe can pop a dial lock in seconds.

[QUOTE=Victor]
Sliding it into it's own cubby hole prior to bolting it down is a good idea as well. A RSC can be opened with common tools in a matter of mintues from the back, sides, or top. Most RSC's are thin wall sheet (.120 thick or less) in these areas. Might want to lock up your tools if you have any too. Getting your safe pealed with your own drill and sawzall might feel twice as bad.
[QUOTE]

Quoted for emphisis. Fire safes ARE NOT burglar resistent. Keep your paper in one sure, but bullion should be stored with smokeless powder in a security safe. TL-30 or better.

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The more I research, the more I'm leaning toward saving up for a Graffunder. Even a small (59*26.5*23.75) C rate Graffunder weighs 1800 lbs empty and has a 1/2" A36 High tensile steel plate shell with concrete composite wall behind it that's almost 1 1/2" inches thick and another 16 gauge steel liner behind that. The door is 1" A36 High tensile steel with an additional 3" width with the concrete composite.

An upgrade to a Group 1 manipulation proof lock is about $175. Anyone ever seen a Graffunder in person? They are works of art.